Re: Windows installation problem at post-install step

On Mon, Jul 22, 2024 at 5:21 PM Sandeep Thakkar <
sandeep(dot)thakkar(at)enterprisedb(dot)com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> EDB's windows installer gets the locales on the system using the
> https://github.com/EnterpriseDB/edb-installers/blob/REL-16/server/scripts/windows/getlocales/getlocales.cpp and
> then substitute some patterns (
> https://github.com/EnterpriseDB/edb-installers/blob/REL-16/server/pgserver.xml.in#L2850)
> I'm not sure why we do that but that is the old code and probably @Dave
> Page <dave(dot)page(at)enterprisedb(dot)com> may know but I'm not sure if that
> piece of code is responsible for this change in encoding in this case.
>
> When I checked the installation log shared by Ertan, I do see that the
> locale passed to initcluster script is the same as returned by the
> getlocales executable.
>
> Executing C:\Windows\System32\cscript //NoLogo "C:\Program
> Files\PostgreSQL\16/installer/server/initcluster.vbs" "NT
> AUTHORITY\NetworkService" "postgres" "****"
> "C:\Users\User1\AppData\Local\Temp/postgresql_installer_cd79fad8b7"
> "C:\Program Files\PostgreSQL\16" "C:\DATA_PG16" 5432 "Turkish,Türkiye" 0
>
> Apology about the top posting. Please ignore this thread. I've replied to
another thread.

> On Mon, Jul 22, 2024 at 6:43 AM Thomas Munro <thomas(dot)munro(at)gmail(dot)com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Jul 22, 2024 at 11:58 AM Ertan Küçükoglu
>> <ertan(dot)kucukoglu(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>> > Thomas Munro <thomas(dot)munro(at)gmail(dot)com>, 21 Tem 2024 Paz, 23:27
>> tarihinde şunu yazdı:
>> >> 2. Some existing database clusters which had been installed with the
>> >> name "Turkish_Turkey.1254" became unstartable when the OS upgrade
>> >> renamed that locale to "Turkish_Türkiye.1254". I'm trying to provide
>> >> a pathway[2] to fix such systems in core PostgreSQL in the next minor
>> >> release. Everyone affected probably already found another way but at
>> >> least next time a country is renamed this might help with the next
>> >> point too.
>> >
>> > I was also hit by that OS update.
>> > There is a Microsoft tool for creating a locale installer
>> > https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=41158
>> > Using that tool and adding a second locale Turkish_Turkey.1254 (name
>> before Microsoft update) in the OS can fix your broken PostgreSQL.
>> > I believe most people simply choose this path.
>> > There are also several blogs/articles written in Turkish about the
>> problem.
>>
>> If that's easy and good enough then maybe I should abandon that
>> on-the-fly renaming patch and we should just do a little documentation
>> note...
>>
>> >> 3. I'd also like to teach initdb to use BCP47 names like "tr-TR"
>> >> instead of those names by default (ie if you don't specify a locale
>> >> name explicitly), and have proposed that before[3] but it hasn't gone
>> >> in due to lack of testing/reviews from Windows users. It seems like
>> >> that doesn't matter much in practice to all the people using the
>> >> popular EDB installer, since it apparently takes control of picking
>> >> the locale and explicitly passes it in (and screws up the encoding as
>> >> we have now learned).
>> >
>> > If I am not mistaken BCP47 names are already used in Linux systems.
>> > Using them would make PostgreSQL use the same locale names across Linux
>> and Windows systems.
>>
>> Not exactly. POSIX systems use
>> [language[_territory][(dot)codeset][(at)modifier]], but POSIX doesn't say
>> what any of those components are[1] (are they ISO country codes?
>> English words? Hieroglyphs?), so, curiously, those Windows names like
>> "English_United States.1252" are probably POSIX-conforming. Every
>> real POSIX system of course uses ISO language and country codes these
>> days (though I still recall other names being used years ago), so they
>> look similar to the simpler kinds of BCP47 tags, which are just
>> language-country with the same ISO codes but a different separator.
>> They diverge further once you get into the finer points with more
>> components. Incidentally that lack of standardisation is the reason
>> you can't say that the glibc ".utf8" ending is "wrong", even though it
>> is obviously stupid :-p (all systems I know accept .UTF-8, 'cause
>> that's what Ken Thompson, Rob Pike and the Unicode standard called
>> it). I suspect that Windows accepts the POSIX style en_US too, but
>> it's not what the manual tells you to use.
>>
>> But really we shouldn't have to know or care how locales are named; we
>> should get the names from the OS in the first place, and then we
>> should remember them and give them back to the OS at the right times.
>> The two problems here is that Windows has two kinds, one unstable over
>> time and with illegal (for us) characters in the name, and one stable;
>> we need to find all the places where the old unstable ones can get
>> into our system, and block them off. I'm aware of two places now: the
>> EDB installer, and initdb's default for people who run it on the
>> command line with giving an explicit name.
>>
>> > I can help with the testing part. Let me know the details, please.
>>
>> Thanks! I will rebase that patch, and CC you on the thread.
>>
>> [1]
>> https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/basedefs/V1_chap08.html
>>
>
>
> --
> Sandeep Thakkar
>
>
>

--
Sandeep Thakkar