Re: Non-personal blogs on Planet

On 26/02/2020 09:31, Magnus Hagander wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 3:26 AM Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
>> On 26/02/2020 00:58, Jonathan S. Katz wrote:
>>
>> On 2/25/20 6:50 PM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum wrote:
>>
>> On 26/02/2020 00:39, Vik Fearing wrote:
>>
>> On 26/02/2020 00:27, Jonathan S. Katz wrote:
>>
>> On 2/24/20 9:01 AM, Vik Fearing wrote:
>>
>> The case I'm interested in, is allowing conferences to post as
>> themselves and not as any particular organizer.
>>
>> One of the main reasons we have the policy in place is to ensure there
>> is a person attached to the content. It does help to reduce the risk of
>> Planet becoming an advertising/spam feed and IMV, it helps to drive
>> higher quality content knowing that someone has to put their name on
>> what is being syndicated.
>>
>> That's a long way of saying that I'm -1 for changing the policy :)
>>
>> Hmm. Do we not have a way of removing problematic blogs from planet?
>> We should fix that, and then we can revisit this policy.
>>
>> Indeed posts can already be removed, and so can entire blogs. There
>> is an anti-spam policy in place.
>>
>> Instead of fighting spam with "tie content to persons", I rather see a
>> content policy. Not as strict as postings to -announce, but something
>> which can limit what can be posted, and how often.
>>
>> I'm more in favor of this. My biggest concern is the moderation burden
>> by just allowing anyone to post on behalf of a conference. The turnover
>> point that Christophe made actually heightens that concern (and I do
>> understand it from the other side as well, it is certainly convenient to
>> have people write content without having to register a new blog every year).
>>
>> (...though OTOH, I believe the pgeu software does allow for this)
>>
>> Right now, if someone plays by the established rules, nothing prevents
>> this person from posting about every single minor release of a tool.
>> Heck, it's not even against policy to post every commit message as
>> a blog post. Clearly the existing policy/strategy is only good as long
>> as no one starts using loop holes.
>>
>> (Great, now everyone knows and moderating is going to be that much
>> harder :P)
>>
>>
>> Why? Nothing to moderate, it's all valid content ;-)
>>
>>
>>
>> I don't see why this policy can't be expanded to allow certain content
>> posted under, let's say, community accounts. This can be conferences
>> and PostgreSQL related tools. That should already be the majority.
>>
>> I'd be in favor for this, with the right policy. Most, if not all, of
>> the content policies are in place, so I would go with one related to the
>> frequency of blog posts. The goal would be to ensure that, much like
>> -announce, we keep the content coming through Planet balanced. We don't
>> want it to be dominated by articles coming from event blogs, but
>> likewise ensure community events have good visibility.
>>
>>
>> Traditionally posting frequency on Planet is higher than on -announce.
>>
>> The problem I see is two-fold: conferences, and projects/tools. Don't think
>> that anything else needs a non-personal account, certainly not companies.
>>
>>
>> I don't have a good idea how to policy tools. How about:
>>
>>
>> Non-personal accounts for PostgreSQL related tools can post about major
>> version changes, bugfix releases, and content directly related to the project
>> itself. All other content (as example: tuning, configuration, best practices, ...)
>> need to be posted from a personal account.
> So if they want to make an announcement of a new feature as well as a
> tutorial on how to set it up. They have to split that in two?

No, and as I mentioned above, the list is meant as a starting
point, not as a final proposal. If something is not covered in the
list, there are a couple ways:

* It's a clear violation and the guidelines already have a policy for
violations in place
* It's something overlooked, and the policy should be amended

>> That certainly needs a better wording ...
>>
>> For conferences:
>>
>> Non-personal postings for conferences are limited to Community recognized
>> conferences. The items on the following list can each warrant a separate
>> posting on Planet:
>>
>> Conference announcement
>> Call for Papers open
>> Call for Sponsors open
>> Call for Papers closed
>> Schedule published
>> Registration open
>> Conference starts
>> Conference ends
>> Summary
>> Major conference changes (like date or location change)
>>
>>
>> Did I miss any major items in the list?
> Speaker changed of a talk?
> Speaker changed of an important keynote talk?
> Topic changed of an important keynote talk?
> Number of tracks changed (can be at least as important as schedule published).
> Registration closed?
> Call for sponsors closed?
>
> Making a bulletpoint list like that of exactly what is allowed is
> *always* going to end up something reasonable that's just outside the
> list.

At which point will you find new things for the list? And additional
question: at which point is posting about this against policy today?

It's not that this violates any policy, heck I pointed out the contrary.
It's just that the conference posts this, not Magnus or Andreas.

> Which makes it very clear that there is absolutely no way that his
> will work without doing pre-moderation on posts to planet.
>
> Are you also volunteering to set up a team to do said pre-moderation
> and make sure that all posts are moderated within reasonable time, as
> well as deal with the complaints when they're not? :)

I don't understand why this needs pre-moderation?

Blogs are still pre-approved, and something which looks fishy
(PostgreSQL 419 Conference in Nigeria) doesn't need to be approved
in the first place. Content-wise nothing is changed with this policy change,
and if there is no need for content moderation today, there is no need
for moderation with a different account. Plus the 3 strike system is in
place.

--
Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum
German PostgreSQL User Group
European PostgreSQL User Group - Board of Directors
Volunteer Regional Contact, Germany - PostgreSQL Project