Re: [HACKERS] SAP and MySQL ... [and Benchmark]

On Fri, 2003-06-13 at 12:10, Lamar Owen wrote:
> On Friday 13 June 2003 10:33, Robert Treat wrote:
> > This overlooks the fact that you can't earn credibility with some of our
> > community unless you hack on the back-end. The uproar over the 7.3 press
> > release was a fine example of what happens when the "advocacy" guys try
> > to make a change to something non-technical that the "technical" guys
> > don't approve of.
>
> Well, a marketing team doesn't need credibility with the hackers as much as it
> needs credibility with the users. Along that bent, the user-grade press
> release should not appear on Hackers. Rather, a technical release-notes is
> needed there, concocted by core.
>
> In order to be credible, one must neither underhype nor overhype -- but there
> is a correct mix of hype in there, because non-tech people love to be wowed.
>
> And then we technical people need to let the marketing people do their thing,
> with core keeping the marketing people well-informed of what the release will
> actually do.
>
> So I see a core marketing team having a least one person who, if not an active
> developer, actively follows hackers and understands the technical details of
> the coming release. That person needs to have enough development chops to
> competently install and test a beta to see where it's going. That person
> then needs to be able to translate the jargon into userspeak, and explain the
> draft userspeak document to the rest of the marketing core, who can then
> translate that into pressspeak for the press release.
>
> The hardest part of this is the coordination of the effort -- first, making
> sure the timing is correct, and second making sure the facts are straight.
> This person will need to have a thick skin, because that position will get
> complaints from hacker and marketer alike.
>
> And the developers who are not marketers need to let them do the job. If you
> don't want the marketer to interfere with development, then don't interfere
> with marketing. But the two cores will need to closely coordinate. The
> liasons between them will need to be able to work well with both groups.
>

are people willing to delay releases for marketing purposes? we seem to
be into a nasty habit of release on holidays which means it has taken us
a few days to get all of the websites updated and emails sent out. if we
could get core to support the idea that a release date must get approval
from the advocacy guys before it can be announced that would be helpful.

that's the kind of issue that i see causing problems with the technical
side of the community and i'm not sure any amount of credibility with
the users will help.

> I prefer the developer-driven style, but I do understand that the typical user
> doesn't fully appreciate the fine points of the release notes. And we CAN do
> a better job in communicating with people just how great PostgreSQL really
> is. And that job isn't about facts, it's about impressions. Impressions are
> more stubborn than facts, IME.

:-)

>
> The current 'PostgreSQL Weekly News' is a great step in that direction, BTW.
> I still remember my first taste of Hackers; I thought that things moved kinda
> slow in here (because there never really was any meat on what was going on on
> the website). Boy, was I ever wrong!
>
> Getting the Linux, FreeBSD, and other geek news sites their press release is
> just as important, but, that's a different audience who needs a different
> press release. ZDNet and its ilk could get the mainstream release, with only
> a link to the homepage. The geek news gets a meatier press release, with
> links to the home page, downloads, and release notes. And Hackers gets the
> release notes. One size does not fit all.

i think the disconnect here is that in the past all aspects of marketing
postgresql have been made by the technical guys. now you have a group
of people who want to change the way that things are done and if the new
people's decisions are going to override the previous policies that were
put in place, we need some form acceptance of that and the folks who i
see giving that acceptance is the core group. The press releases fall
into this category, since the current standard is that we don't make
announcements of "point" releases, but the advocacy group is recognizing
that something could be gained from spreading the word to right right
target audiences. Should we just go and do it? I guess based on Tom's
post we should.

Robert Treat
--
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